The track layout is logical if not initially intuitive. By looking "up", the background/main video is always on track one. Any added objects, such as images, videos, audio or titles, can simply be added underneath, and they will show on top of the background. If it was the other way round, when you added objects, you'd have to continually push down the background/insert tracks to make way for the extra stuff you're putting in. The Magix way actually works well and I think you'll get used to it quickly.

You can limit the number of tracks you see: File>Settings>Movie.

And, look at it this way, 1 is the lowest number, it's on the bottom. 2 comes next, then 3, etc. I think that we all learned this in primary school.

In Vegas, 1 is the lowest number, the background. Want to put something on top of it? It should be 2, no? No, whatever is on 1 has to be pushed to a higher number, so now the background is on track 2, or 3 or 4 or 26 or 52. Soon, you don't know where the bottom track is anymore. It can be on many tracks along the timeline. Totally backwards. What were the programmers thinking? They were thinking that no one would ever need more than a few tracks and thus inserted tracks above, forcing the user to move the background to a higher number track, lower on the screen, but a higher number. For some reason, they didn't think to make the bottom track always track 1. In Vegas, why is track 1 not the bottom of the pack? Sorry, we can't help you with Vegas.

In MEP and VPX, the background stays on the bottom - the lowest track number. It does not have to be moved to another track like in other programs; it stays at 1.

There is no problem having more tracks is there? If you need to put something on a track, just put it there. No need to create a new track like in other programs. Tracks do not take up memory if there is nothing on them.

In MEP and VPX, a track is a track. There are no special audio tracks, video tracks, photo tracks, composite tracks, weird tracks, just tracks.

In VPX, I use templates that I make and I name and colour the tracks. Of course, it's flexible. I have background video/photos on tracks 1 and 3, associated audio always shown, thus on tracks 2 and 4. Track 5 is reserved for audio effects and music provided by the program or Magix. The program always tries to put audio or audio effects from templates or imported music on track 5. Track 6 is for narration, 8 for background music that I bring in.

Tracks 9 through 12 are for titles. Some title templates take 3 or 4 tracks. However, if I use photo montages or PiP, then I'll have to push them down and to 13 and onwards, and if they also have text, then it will be on even higher tracks.

Thus, I pretty much know where everything is.

Bottom line, 1 is the lowest, 2 comes on top, 3 comes on top of that... That is all that you have to remember.

John CB

@browj2 To be honest I had never realised that VMS numbered the tracks "upside down". Probably because the numbers occupy a very small screen area and it's the adjacent track title which can be renamed to reflect something more useful that I use. The actual track numbers are insignificant, and for me don't serve any purpose.

Anyway in real life an object placed on top of another covers up what's underneath it and that's the way I prefer my video tracks to work. Looking "upwards" isn't natural.

But track order aside the biggest barrier to my using MEP (I've trialled it several times) is its lack of a Media Pane. I've not come across another consumer editor that doesn't have this. To quote your words "What were the programmers thinking". The lack of a media pane doesn't suit the type of movies I make and the workflow I prefer.

@ericlnz

Hi Eric,

Both Vegas and MEP/VPX (and all others) should have adopted the same scheme - Track 1 at the bottom of the screen, 2 above it, etc.

MEP doesn't have the media pane, but VPX does - the Project Temp Folder (PTF).

See this one and this one (both mine) for details and uses.

Note that in the image above, there are multiple movies (thus multiple timelines), and the top 6 items are subfolders, each containing assets used or to be used. The Name, Description, Scene and Take fields can be filled in and modified. Broken up assets and assets (objects or events) with effects can be added to the PTF, making them easy to be reused.

Example, I use an arrow pointer in my tutorials. I bring it into the project, change the zoom setting to 35, add or insert it into the PTF and change the name to Arrow 35. The original entry is still there, even if removed from the timeline.

I can find an object from the PTF entry on the timeline using the search feature of the PTF. Etc.

Thus, we have the Media Pool with direct access to files on the drives and a red light to indicate if the object is in the project, plus the Project Temp Folder containing assets and movies (which could be nested sequences), also showing a red light if the asset is on the timeline.

My experience with Vegas Pro 15 was that I had to drag objects into the bin and then onto the timeline. In VPX, drag from the Media Pool or Windows Explorer directly onto the timeline, and they also show up in the Project Temp Folder automatically.

Note my other comments about saving and opening Project Temp Files themselves - thus standard assets can be saved as entries in the PTF and imported/added to other projects. And more.

Vegas - no multiple timelines, and nested sequences are separate projects, not within the same project. Cumbersome.

John CB

Never used an editor with a media pane. I have looked at my daughter's Premiere Pro and thought, goodness that's a complicated layout.

@browj2 With VMS the track numbers don't appear to serve any purpose other than reference. Interestingly your comments have caused me to poke around and I find if I move a track up or down then its number changes so they are always numbered downwards. Just shows how little attention I pay to the numbers! It's the track label I look at.

Yes, you can drag from the Explorer pane to the timeline or even from an external Windows Explorer pane. But it sometimes takes a second or two.

@AAProds Premier Pro is a Pro programme so has more bells and whistles. I've never used it but once sat with someone whilst they edited. My impression was it went about tasks in a cumbersome non intuitive way. But others swear by it.

Anyway whichever editor you use and how you use it, it's only a tool. It's what you produce with your editor that matters.

I'm going to add a touch of cynicism here and say differences in any type of program from one company to another is in part an effort to lock the user into a system. It's hard enough learning any program to any degree of depth and once you have a workflow you are used to it gets counter intuitive to do otherwise. Easier to upgrade once locked in than to get used to something new.

Another part may be down to intellectual copyright. How layouts look or behave may well be protected property hence the no 'copying or altering of program' clauses in end user agreements. etc.

But I mainly agree with ericinz.

Ray.

@ericlnz

Hi Eric,

No comments on the Project Temp Folder?

I am use to scrolling downwards to see more tracks, not upwards. Most everything is on the top tracks.

I must open Vegas and try again.

@CubeAce

Hi Ray,

You are right. It's what you are used to.

I started with Pinnacle Studio and still have the second most recent version. It has a couple of things that MEP/VPX do not, so I use it occasionally, but not for editing.

John CB

@browj2

Hi John.

I think that as I started any editing at all with music DAWS where track placement to an extent doesn't matter, it has never bothered me where a track needs to be placed.

Adobe I think would have taken the format from photography where layers are naturally in a downward position when adding effects and passed a familiar concept to it's photographer base across to using video. Not necessarily because the workflow is better.

Vegas is a funny one to explain but originally completely Japanese in origin, it may have been down to cultural differences but at one time was considered the best video editing software you could get.

But as I say, once into a work routine it's difficult to adapt to a new one. Try going from Photoshop to Gimp. That did my head in! At least most video applications have more common ground than differences. I did play with Power Director some time back. I think I got a copy with a video card. It was OK. Worked fine but I wasn't really doing video at that time. By the time I did get into video I'd more of less forgotten how Power director was set up.

What I don't understand and I'm not complaining or singling anyone out, is it seems to me people now buy products and then demand changes to go with their expectations. I don't buy a Mini and then expect it to be refitted to be a Ferrari but people buying action cameras and Mirrorless or DSLRs often do. Maybe it's fair to ask if the next incarnation could have this or that feature if only to keep pace with competitors offerings but changing specs on something you should have already checked out?

We have a saying in the South East of England about people wanting champagne lifestyles on Lemonade money 😉.

Anyway that's off topic somewhat.

Once I get going....................

Ray.

No comments on the Project Temp Folder?

@browj2 Sorry John I forgot to comment. Your PTF is very similar to VMS's Project Media Folder in "Details" view mode.

As for Pinnacle, it's an editor that is popular with my video friends but I've never played with it because Corel don't provide a trial. The nearest I get is studying the extensive user guide which is available to anybody. According to the guide its tracks are top down, like Vegas. I've come across one editor (Corel Video Studio or Cyberlink Power Director?) where you can choose the track order, up or down! At least that would make everyone happy!

Thanks for the responses. I guess it's easy enough to get used to the MEP track ordering.

I really like Movie Edit Pro's interface and I like the way panes can be easily snapped into place for customisation over my two monitors. The software seems plenty capable for my needs though I wish it had a source monitor but understand that's in Video Pro X. I think I will focus on learning Movie Edit Pro as it's quite intuitive except for the reversal of track priority.

I also bought Pinnacle Studio the other month but have minor issues with it and I don't like Corel's constant ads for upgrades, etc.

One thing I noticed with Vegas Movie Studio, MEP and Pinnacle Studio is they all start their track numbering with 1 from the top track so I guess that's why the confusion arose for me when MEP seemed prioritise physically-placed objects higher than those tracks on top.